Rule: Once per hand each player may draw a card after playing a passive special (discard duplicates).
What's a passive special?
A special is passive if it's not active.
Active specials are as follows:
-Any special that can be used to do damage
-Any special that can be used to defend
-Any special that can be used to affect cards from the current battle.
-Any special that can force the opponent to discard a card in hand or placed.
-Any special that can make some of the opponent's cards unusable this battle.
-HQ specials
If you look at those restrictions you're pretty much left with cards that no one plays (with very few exceptions). These cards aren't bad in and of themselves it's just that they're not worth playing because they take up a card in your hand. Give the player a the ability to draw to replace, and suddenly they aren't as terrible.
The keyword in what defines an active special is can. So if a player uses a negate to remove a hit from a past battle, it's being used passively, but it doesn't have to be used that way.
First of all Any Hero cards become a bit more attractive because the Loki, Black Cat, and Alien Symbiote specials would all be considered passive, and these are some of the ones that people don't play with. The AT specials are good because they're two for one. Like Spider-man's Spider Senses are also worth using.
This was one of the New England OverPower rules. I liked it alot. I think some other guys on here play with your rule as well.
Question for the board: How beneficial is modifying grid's with bonuses, like +2 to your character or -2 to an opponents character? Should these be considered active? Unlucky at Love's -2 puts a character in a bad place. I've conceded many times to keep my character alive. Not saying it's broken or anything like that I assure you... just seems like an attack. Boosting your own character's grid doesn't seem nearly as dangerous, so I can see them being passive. And I realize its only once per turn that you can draw to replace. Just wanted some opinions on that.
What do you think about starting the game with a 'passive special' or something similar placed? For instance a character like Wolverine could start his his 'heal' special placed or Mystic could start with her AZ placed. Actually I would make it slightly different than traditional placing since I don't want it to compete for a spot with a 'better' special. We could use the battlesite placement method.
One special per character could be placed under the character card at the beginning of the game and is not revealed until played just like the battlesite specials. You don't however have to use an activator to use the special. This would effectively increase the minimum deck size to 60, but the specials would never actually be placed in the deck and they would still be discarded to the discard pile. I see this a bit like an inherent ability for everyone or a further enhancement to those that already have a I.A.
It might just make cards like war machine's 'energy field' or any of the AJ specials useable. Perhaps an additional rule that only 1 of those type 'inherent character specials' or passive specials could be used per battle would also be fair. :)
I made a few characters back in the day that began the game with a special card placed to them. Usually a shift or a remove hit from permanent record, but I made a Ken (from Street Fighter) that started the game with an attack placed to him. It was a 4 or 6 or something... nothing too big. Probably too good though. Anyway, I always like it, and most of the time it was a reveal 2 cards in hand or something that didn't affect the game too much, but did do something cool.
I think that's a good idea. Just need a good way to identify a "passive" special. Most are self explanitory I guess, but are there any that straddle the fence? I'm assuming no grid modifiers, no cards that affect opponents characters or placed cards, no numerical attacks of course... no negates or defensive cards. Mainly reveal cards from hand or top of draw pile specials, remove hits... what else?
I don't have it fully defined in my head yet, but broadly speaking I'd put the restrictions below on the specials that could be placed in this way.
No OPD specials
No numerical attacks
No defensive specials
Only one 'pregame character placed special' can be played per battle.
(Perhaps an ally card should be necessary to activate them...)
Here are some of the specials I think could legitimately be used under these rules. (Of course this doesn't cover all possibilities.)
AJ, AL, AM, AF, AZ, CQ, DM, EQ, HU
I also like the idea of the specials below being used, but it may be questionable.
BT? EB?
How about also, only if that character doesn't have an inherit ability or the ia is null - "may play x from reserve" when they aren't in reserve.
Quote from: BasiliskFang on January 04, 2013, 07:29:59 AM
How about also, only if that character doesn't have an inherit ability or the ia is null - "may play x from reserve" when they aren't in reserve.
I think the I.A. restriction may be to harsh. Think of a character like Gambit. His I.A. is definitely not a reason to to keep him from taking advantage of this mechanic. Also you might actually have a reason to use his AK special.
I also thought about restricting the 'pregame special' to use only when you've had to discard a card due to being unusable or a duplicate, or when the opponent draws an extra card for any reason, but again that may be too harsh as well. It would address any card advantage issues though.
The other player would have the same advantages as you would... I think as long as it's passive, it's ok. You could just make a list of codes that would qualify, and just play those specials that way. If it's placed, it takes the slot for special placement. I think that's fair.
Quote from: thetrooper27 on January 05, 2013, 03:57:01 AM
If it's placed, it takes the slot for special placement. I think that's fair.
As I mentioned in my first post I don't think it should take the slot for the special placed normally in game. It would defeat the purpose as these specials are already not used due to better options a character might have anyway. Why would you want to place Deadpool's AJ pregame when his AS (OPD) might come up first hand and you wouldn't be able to place it?
I like the idea of having those specials essentially in limbo. Not played, not placed. One per character not in the deck would be an interesting way of making these cards useful.
Kinda like a side deck to be used whenever you feel the need? A utility deck. One per character.
Quote from: Hotobu on January 13, 2013, 05:42:46 PM
I like the idea of having those specials essentially in limbo. Not played, not placed. One per character not in the deck would be an interesting way of making these cards useful.
Still trying to figure out the proper way to 'activate' these cards, while attempting to make sure it still
feels like OP or something they would/could have invented.
Perhaps they could work similar to events in that you could activate one 'passive special' right after the event resolution phase regardless if an event is played or not. Being able to do this could be contingent on whether you had to discard cards from your hand due to unusables or duplicates prebattle. This could be the resources 'burned' to use the card. (The discard rule may or may not be necessary as I wouldn't want to penalize the player that didn't have any discards.)
Alternatively, it could be that you simply have to 'burn' to cards from the draw pile to activate the passive special prebattle. (Thought of that while typing the discard rule above. ;D)
Playing one of these specials prebattle could be responded to in the traditional fashion with a negate or whatever. Some specials allow for an attack after the battle has ended or prevent a battle from ending so playing one special prebattle doesn't seem so unreasonable or foriegn. Again, when thinking of the special codes I listed above if feels ok to me. I mean deadpool using an AJ or wolverine healing
between battles is kinda cool in my opinion. 8)
I must say I'm really liking this idea, but I'm curious as to any balance issues it could cause you guys might see.
I think once per battle would be sufficient. It would have to be during the battle or else something like an AJ special wouldn't be much use.
The AJ would still be useful if played after discards for dups and unusables and the redraw for an event prebattle. I think there should be a cost associated either way they are played however. Discarding 2 cards from the draw pile may be just right. Perhaps 3 cards could be discarded if you wanted to use the card prebattle.
It seems to me that they should just be used as regular cards in hand, except they sit outside the game, and I think the once per turn idea is a good one. They don't need a cost to be played... they suck! Burning a good card in the deck to use it would be a waste of a good card. Maybe have a limit on how many you can have in your "side deck". Like 3 or 4. Most of the cards used would be look at 2 cards in opponents hand or top 2 of their deck. Nothing game breaking... your biggest advantage is stalling your turn. With each player having the option to start the game with a few specials like these, I would say they're fair. My two pennies.
1 for each frontline and 2for reserve, sounds ok? 1 opd max. I using along side any heroes this could be really nice.
How about an activator but redraw immediately when drawn or when used.
Quote from: BasiliskFang on January 15, 2013, 03:09:11 AM
1 for each frontline and 2for reserve, sounds ok? 1 opd max. I using along side any heroes this could be really nice.
How about an activator but redraw immediately when drawn or when used.
No OPDs and only 1 card per character is best. The reason why I didn't want them to be attached to a card
inside the deck, like an activator, is they are competing for space with something better. Again this is why they aren't used in the first place. I see these 'subpar' specials more like 'minor inherent abilities' which is why I think allowing them to be placed before the game and accessed when desired is cool
Another special I was looking at the other day that would really get a boost by this would be Falcon's FY special. I think Falcon being able to start the game with that card placed and activate it when the right cards come up really creates possibilities for a different strategy.
Quote from: Nostalgic on January 17, 2013, 07:45:09 PM
Quote from: BasiliskFang on January 15, 2013, 03:09:11 AM
1 for each frontline and 2for reserve, sounds ok? 1 opd max. I using along side any heroes this could be really nice.
How about an activator but redraw immediately when drawn or when used.
No OPDs and only 1 card per character is best. The reason why I didn't want them to be attached to a card inside the deck, like an activator, is they are competing for space with something better. Again this is why they aren't used in the first place. I see these 'subpar' specials more like 'minor inherent abilities' which is why I think allowing them to be placed before the game and accessed when desired is cool
Another special I was looking at the other day that would really get a boost by this would be Falcon's FY special. I think Falcon being able to start the game with that card placed and activate it when the right cards come up really creates possibilities for a different strategy.
It radically changes the game (in a way) but I really like your idea. There are so many useless specials. It would be interesting to have a sub deck where each character (or a handful of characters) would start the game with these specials on the side and can activate them at the start of the match or save them for later. Again, it really changes up the game and most purists might be opposed to it, but the idea is at least interesting.
Quote from: Nostalgic on January 17, 2013, 07:45:09 PM
The reason why I didn't want them to be attached to a card inside the deck, like an activator, is they are competing for space with something better.
I know thats why i said: redraw immediately when drawn OR when used (either, not both), like vents.. maybe up the deck count by how many of these cards you're using.
Quote from: BasiliskFang on January 17, 2013, 08:54:10 PM
Quote from: Nostalgic on January 17, 2013, 07:45:09 PM
The reason why I didn't want them to be attached to a card inside the deck, like an activator, is they are competing for space with something better.
I know thats why i said: redraw immediately when drawn OR when used (either, not both), like vents.. maybe up the deck count by how many of these cards you're using.
IDK. I suppose you should just read the earlier posts in the thread... I think burning a turn and non-random access is benefit enough for these cards. ???
Have you done play testing yet?
The more I think about it the more I like the specials starting "in Limbo". As was said they'd basically be one time use inherent abilities. One per character, one use per round. This is even better than putting them in the deck and redrawing for them because there's no threat of them becoming unplayable.
Agreed.
how about
1 choose one special
2 reshuffle draw pile
3 put chosen special on top of draw pile