Brand new mechanic for your consideration...I think the presentation (words on the bottom of the card seems a little unpolished) needs to be tweaked a bit, and maybe the form of the card could use improvement, but conceptually I think this is a well needed meta course correction.
Any thoughts (as always) are encouraged.
(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ciKkzSTMsOk/VHtW0GFt3uI/AAAAAAAACyw/YDM2wvW0dWA/w250/The_Collector.jpg)
The logical counterpart to Any Character: Devourer of Worlds. I like it.
I know this will probably be a stupid question (I have literally HUNDREDS of them in regards to OP rules), but does playing a battlesite/activators preclude playing Any Character cards?
As for the cards, my suggestions:
I think the Any Battlesite makes it clear that this is a special that must be placed under a battlesite, so in the reminder text at the bottom, you can probably take out that clause and just have it read "This card may be played by any Activator card" , or if you like the flow better, "This card may be played by any Activator card from its' battlesite". Or something to that effect. Basically, I feel that the use of Any Battlesite in the reminder text is unnecessarily redundant (and is adding to the amount of space the text needs, which you want to minimize)
Also, how many Any Character attacks are there? I know that at least a few are not attacks (Web-Headed Wizard, Unlucky At Love, etc). I'm just curious if using 4 as the magic number will actually make this more difficult to fight than Devourer of Worlds.
Otherwise I think this looks pretty good, and once the attack number has been verified as balanced or workable, is probably the kind of thing that would be an auto-include for Activator decks like Devourer is for Any Character (anti-activator) decks.
Yes, The Collector would be a perfect equivalent to DOW. I think "Any Battlesite" clarifies that it must be used with/by a Battlesite. It should not be allowed in the same deck as DOW - that would be WAY too much. (Card code should probably be the same.)
Letting it be played be "any Activator" would guarantee it comes out early. Maybe including it in the regular deck is the way to go - that way it comes up randomly like DOW - equivalence.
And yes, Dok, your choice is to use Any Character specials or a Battlesite. Never both. Check out the rules and card type sections of the site.
(http://overpower.ca/cards/specials/1529.png)
it would greatly increase the value of running KL in peoples decks.
a normal battlesite usually runs anywhere from 10-13 activators, a typical any hero deck runs 8-11 any heros on average.
so if the card can be used by any activator it needs to get toned down in that case to even out the playing field.
some any hero's can be placed, and all can be with the proper event, activators cant be placed.
so unless the pool of any hero cards are increased to include more in your deck we gotta tweak that card for balance.
i would agree with having this inserted into the deck instead, or activated only by a Beyonder activator?
i would change the 4 any character cards to 2 or 3, and maybe giving a special note in that card effect that DoW can wipe it out, 1 specific card to wipe it out, and it means they don't get to use DoW against you
fine as is
I like the original idea.
Make it an any homebase, except team overpower.(green card) That way it could be in the deck more random. I would also say max 2 any characters (two for one is enough). Any characters are generally more powerful individually than activators.
Just my thoughts
M
OP GOD
Quote from: OP GOD on November 30, 2014, 02:39:28 PM
I like the original idea.
Make it an any homebase, except team overpower.(green card) That way it could be in the deck more random. I would also say max 2 any characters (two for one is enough). Any characters are generally more powerful individually than activators.
Just my thoughts
M
OP GOD
i must agree
i also think that it should have a random chance of appearing like DOW, having it work with any activator basically means that it's out first turn every game.
Wasn't DOW made to make Any Heroes able to stack up with Battlesites? Wouldn't this card put Any Heroes back where they were before DoW was introduced?
I have a few suggestions (some of which use suggestions from other people).
1/ I think the number of Any Character attacks should be three. Here's my reasoning. The typically used Any Characters that act as attacks are: Power Leech, Death from Above, Gamma Terror, Bastion, Confusion (I am assuming Unlucky at Love and God of Mischief do not see a lot of play). That is 5 out of the 8-10 typically used in decks. Requiring four Any Character attacks means you can't kill the card if it comes out after using/discarding 2 of the 5. For Battlesites, there are typically 10-12 cards with 6-8 of those being attacks. A ratio of 3/5 for The Collector falls within the ratio for Devourer of Worlds (4/6, 4/7, 4/8). A requirement of 4/5 for The Collector would be more like 5/6, 6/7, or 6/8 for DoW, which would be very hard to do for decks with battlesites.
2a/ Keep it as a battlesite card, but make it so that only the Beyonder activator can grab it. This makes it such that there is effectively only one copy in the deck. It also gives battlesite players the option to fetch a different special with the Beyonder Activator (e.g., if the opponent is not playing with Any Characters). The one disadvantage to this option is that you can't play The Collector in a deck that has Beyonder as a character.
2b/ As someone else suggested above, make it an Any Homebase card with the restriction that it cannot be played in deck containing Any Character cards. This would allow someone to run it in a deck that had neither a Battlesite nor Any Characters (a potentially interesting metagame call if The Collector or DoW are in every deck). Also, restricting it to be used in decks without Any Characters removes the need to add a clause saying it can't be used with Team Overpower (OP God's suggestion).
Very good suggestions MHC.
Also, another reason to lower the number of any heroes to get rid of the collector is that with activators you have more choice when you discard an activator to get rid of DOW. So even if you have to use an activator against DOW, there's a good chance you'll get that activator again and be able to play which ever battlesite card you want.
I like MHC's #1 suggestion. If the card is as Aspect, a KL Special can't remove it from the game like DOW.
I think a KL would still remove it from play.
Edit: Nevermind, you are correct, KLs target specials.
sounds like we'll see a lot more caliban since it sounds like whoever plays DOW / collector first has advantage? If DOW is played can you get /play collector?
Another good reason to make it a Special.
Thank you everyone for the great (and fast) feedback.
Issue #1 - accessible by any activator is a bit overpowered - Possible fixes:
(1) Make it OPD - it's a designation that I would sort of roll my eyes at, because if it's going in a battlesite, you couldn't have more than 1 - what it WOULD do is it would eliminate the battlesite's other OPD - I think this would be sort of game-breaking, especially since most people pointed out that this would be a Must Include in battlesite decks.
(2) Make it only acessible only to Beyonder - I really like this idea; I was kicking around whether I felt that of having this card only accessible using the Beyonder activator - I was actually toying with the idea of making this a Beyonder special card, but I'm not sure I would be okay with this being as part of a Beyonder-team Any Hero deck to kill other non-Beyonder any hero decks.
I'm not sure where I stand on these possible solutions, at the moment...
Issue #2 - 4 any hero attacks is a tough hurdle to get over - Possible fixes:
(1) Reduce the number of attacks necessary to melt the card - I'm on the fence about this.
(2) Change the mechanic from "attack" to some kind of mechanic that allows any any-hero card to be thrown at this thing, while still taking an entire turn to do it...Seems very complicated but might work.
(3) Change the mechanic all together - the ZY mechanic from Thing's stonewall might work better "Play during battle. Opponent may not use Any Character Special cards unless Opponent also discards 2 card per action. Cards may be Placed or in Hand. This card may not be negated and remains in play for the remainder of the game, or until 2 special cards have been played this way." [the number of cards discarded, and the number of cards until removed from play can be tweaked...maybe 1/4 works? Either way, you're discarding 4 cards, and in a way this is not as strong as DoW because your opponent can discard anything they want, and continue to play the cards that they want to play......Maybe make it 1 random discard for every any hero special, FROG with no cap of 4 cards?
i would say no to the OPD part...when i go battlesites its usually for a specific OPD im using in my deck, two, if it was non opd, it would give opening for characters on a battlesite with little to no good special cards for access, even locations without an official character in game yet. it would solve lots of those issues.
it would be a great any battlesite card, it would be like having another possible card like A-Next in your deck. if you do make it an aspect card, give it special instructions that it can't be used in the homebase of team overpower
(http://overpower.ca/cards/homebases/42.png)
we don't want an any hero deck with ability to shut down any hero and battlesite decks, it should be one or the other. to balance the equation of meta cards
and if you went the non OPD route... you could lessen the effect and have it more consistent, if they remove or negate it, you can play another one later on
to be useable by Beyonder it would have to be a non-opd card fyi
correct me if im wrong... but can't any activator card be used as attacks against DoW even if the specials are non offensive?
and one way to correct or solve the issue of Beyonder being used in a deck and you can't use this... we just need to create the activator card for the collector... his own hero card to be used as strictly the activator to get it out
(http://cmro.travis-starnes.com/images/characters/collector.jpg)
a good image, give him stats and innate... he could be like 8-8-8-8 Galactus with 1 special. 24 points
that would clear up the Beyonder character/battlesite issue
it shouldn't be a limit if you play Beyonder, you are paying major points to utilize him
I would hate this card to be real. They made DoW because nobody used Any-Heros, and battlesites were way more powerful at the time. DoW evened it up, but possibly tipped it to where any heroes became slightly more powerful. A battlesite deck having the ability to shut off any heroes would just take it back to when battlesites were easily more powerful.
Plus, in a way, DoW lessened the fun of the game for alot of people, as alot of games outcome could be determined by "how fast can i draw my DoW". But you didnt have to worry about that in BS vs BS games or AH vs AH games. Now, with this card, almost every game would be largely tilted towards a huge momentum advantage of whoever drew there DoW/Collector card first.
I don't like it. They need to make a Any-Homebase aspect that is a KL special.
i don't think that this card will ever be tournament legal but if it was I'd probably go with a deck with no any-heroes and no battle site...lol.
A lot of good feedback, much appreciated. I'll take this back to the drawing board for a bit.