Palatinus' OverPower Forum

and i came up with the following 59 characters (morlocks and shi'ar aren't exactly villains, but they didn't get marvels cards, and xbabies i didn't include)

with the marvels cards, the vast majority are excellent cards.  without getting into who should get what card, i was wondering if you agreed with my breakdown of what characters need what type of card

Level 1: these characters need game-changing cards, since the majority are virtually unplayable as is

*ABSORBING MAN                   
*THE ACOLYTES                      7-6-3-3 (19)
*APOCALYPSE           6-4-4 (14)   5-5-7-6 (23)
*HYDRA                             5-6-5-5 (21)  17-Points for Deckbuilding
*PSYCHO-MAN                        5-2-5-6 (18)  "Emotion Box" from Reserve

Level 2: these characters need excellent cards.  they are borderline useful, but a single great card could see them in many decks (think dr strange's AD)

*BARON MORDO                       7-3-2-6 (18)
BULLSEYE                          4-8-4-2 (18)
*CARNAGE              3-7-5 (15)   5-7-4-2 (18)  Team +5 to Venture when KO'd
CEREBRO                           6-3-3-8 (20)
*DOCTOR DOOM          7-6-6 (19)   5-3-4-8 (20)
*DR./DOCTOR OCTOPUS   3-6-5 (14)   2-5-6-7 (20)
*DRACULA                           3-5-6-8 (22)
*THE ENFORCERS                     3-6-4-3 (16)  2 Specials Placed, not dups
*GOBLYN QUEEN                      7-5-2-5 (19)  Attacks w/ E Pc not shifted
GREEN GOBLIN                      4-4-6-6 (20)  I Power cards +1 to attack
HOBGOBLIN            2-6-3 (11)   4-6-6-3 (19)  S Power cards +1 to attack
*JUGGERNAUT           3-4-7 (14)   4-5-8-2 (19)
THE KREE                          6-5-4-7 (22)
LEADER                            3-4-2-7 (16)  +2 defense "Twisted Mentality"
*MANDARIN             6-5-3 (14)   7-4-3-5 (19)  F Power cards +2 for defense
MR. SINISTER         6-6-5 (17)   4-5-4-8 (21)
MOLE MAN                          4-4-2-6 (16)  +2 defense if "Social Outcast"
MORBIUS              1-3-7 (11)   5-3-6-5 (19)  Only Cum KO by 30 or more pnts
*MYSTERIO             6-3-4 (13)   6-3-4-6 (19)  Not Spect KOd w/ E Power cards
*MYSTIQUE             6-4-2 (12)   5-6-3-6 (20)  F Power cards +1 to attack
*OMEGA RED            2-6-4 (12)   6-7-5-2 (20)
*POST                              1-6-4-6 (17)  May not be attackd by Location
*PUPPET MASTER                     6-3-1-6 (16)  "Alicia Masters" from Reserve
RED SKULL                         3-5-4-7 (19)  Not Cum KO'd w/ I Power cards
*RHINO                1-4-7 (12)   2-6-7-1 (16)
*SCORPION                          5-5-7-2 (19)  +1 attack if opp 4,5,6 Compltd
SHADOW KING                       7-1-1-7 (16)
*SUPER SKRULL         5-3-7 (15)   6-4-7-4 (21)
*TASKMASTER                        3-7-4-5 (19)  Use I Pc to avoid any F attack
*TYPHOID MARY                      5-7-3-2 (17)  Attacks w/ F Pc not shifted
*VENOM                6-6-7 (19)   5-6-7-2 (20)

Tier 3: these characters still show up in decks, but are not powerhouses by any means. an average/good card will help them nicely   

BLOB                 3-3-7 (13)   4-5-6-1 (16)  Not Spect KOd w/ S Power cards
BROOD                4-7-5 (16)   3-6-6-4 (19)  May have dup "Brood Spawn"
THE HAND                          2-8-3-6 (19)
*THE HELLFIRE CLUB                 6-4-4-7 (21)
*KINGPIN                           2-4-5-6 (17)  Teamworks from Reserve
*MAGNETO              8-1-2 (11)   8-5-3-6 (22)
THE MARAUDERS                     7-7-3-2 (19)
*ONSLAUGHT                         8-2-6-7 (23)
*SABRETOOTH           1-8-5 (14)   2-8-6-3 (19)
*THE SERPENT SOCIETY               3-6-6-3 (18)  May play Tactics from Reserve

(i put SS in this tier, but i believe they could easily fit in tier 2...their AD is more a hinderance than a help)

Tier 4: these characters are pretty good as is, and show up often in decks.  an average or quirky card won't do much to diminish them

HOLOCAUST                         7-2-6-2 (17)
MOJO                 5-6-2 (13)   6-3-1-6 (16)  M Power cards +1 to attack
*THE REAVERS                       5-7-6-3 (21)
*SENTINELS            7-5-6 (18)   7-5-7-1 (20)

misc: here are the cape citadel characters, since they already make a very good team.  like four freedoms, i think you have to be careful in not giving them 'too powerful' a card.  individually, they could all use a boost, and probably lie somewhere between tiers 2 and 3)

*CRUX                              6-6-2-3 (17)  Avoid any attack w/ a 1I Pc
GREY KING                         6-3-5-7 (21)
LANDSLIDE                         6-4-6-2 (18)  Opp -3 VT when L's tmmate KO'd
*MERCURY                           6-7-5-4 (22)
*RAPTURE                           5-7-2-3 (17)  +1 attack vs. Intellect 7 or 8
XAOS                              7-4-4-1 (16)  Draw 1 when X's teammate KO'd

misc characters that didn't get a marvels card

*THE MORLOCKS                      6-3-8-2 (19)
*SCARLET SPIDER
THE SHI'AR                        5-4-3-8 (20)
*X-BABIES

i'm interested to hear what you guys think.  i'm sure some characters will have to be moved around.  with marvels, some characters that were already great, got greater (hawkeye).  my only goal with this list was to establish which characters needed the most help

Super Skrull doesn't need anymore cards. Having HN, CZ, and BW is plenty and I'd probably consider them to be in your tier 2 or 3.

On the topic on doing further expansions, one thing I'd like to see is all characters be balanced with 10 special cards (not counting globbing characters like Team X or Storm: Neutralized). There are a lot of characters (mostly in DC/Image) that could be very good characters (with their given stats) if they had more specials to play with (all DC characters have 5-6 specials). Image is even worse with some characters only having 3 specials (2 OPDs).

with super skrull, i admit to having a bias because of the character.  however, he's not really level 3 material.  the 8any is a decent special, but the 2 opds are lame.  the 4+discard is nice, but NEVER hits, and the discard 5 is a neat mechanic, but i personally could never get it to work. 

i'm guessing the best way would be best laid plans or gambits marvels.  with best laid though, there's no way to ensure your opponent stays.  if you venture big, they draw the plant cards, negating the purpose of the strategy.  with gambits card, that would put you 2 venture cards down in the battle (with no guarantee that the opponent would have any great cards in the top eight)

also...it occurs to me that i completely forgot that thunderbots already got a marvels card...the hawkeye -10 to venture

...guess they are doomed to remain forever unused

for doctor doom, alot of people have suggested him getting a negate.  personally, i don't think it's enough, since it would still be hard to justify using doom over beast.

how does this sound?  doom gets a non numerical negate, like morbius

Negates the effects of any 1 Special card. May not be used to avoid a numerical attack, or remove a numerical hit. (ED)

but, it is playable from reserve.  that helps doom and makes him a great reserve (8i AND negate) by taking 'advantage' of the fact his specials suck. it also helps the 2 battlesites he's on (wundagore and latveria) by giving an extra defensive card, and also helps them as homebases by giving them a clear reserve character.

thoughts?

very interesting thoughts about D.Doom... my initial reaction is of the "no way!" variety... but then again... maybe. I guess I've seen him used as a decent Reserve with Doombots coming up, so it's hard for me to say he needs help making a case for the Reserve. So, i'm mixed about him.

As for Juggernaut, Marauders, and Mr. Sinister, I think they need to be kicked down the list a lot.

Juggernaut is, well, a juggernaut of offense, needing no real help having a role or being used (just because there might be a cheaper option, doesn't mean he's not still a valuable, viable option).

Marauders have 3 separate level 7 attacks (event with their slight drawbacks), all 3 OPDs are really good, and, despite being nerf'd, Vertigo is still crazy-useful (to the point that it's pretty much always negated if the opponent has a negate available).

Mr. Sinister is the weakest of the three, but still has plenty to offer. Like Juggernaut, he IS a max-8, so he always has that going for him. Despite his expense, he offers a very rare (exlusive) OPD with his Cloning Process, and he has a great lv.9 attack and an off suit AR (even if it's only a 6).

Still, I wouldn't mind them all three to be bumped, for who they are in the comics - i just don't see them in need from a competetive stand point (necessarily).

Those are my thoughts

i agree.  sinister/juggernaut/marauders are decent enough characters...but unfortunately, that's all they are.  really, with the tiers i was just trying to identify which characters show up more often in decks, thus not needing 'as' good a new card.  while that trio is better than say: dracula/omega red/mystique, the difference isn't huge.  any card that could change up the usual characters would be welcome for me.

i haven't put a ton of thought into who needs what type of card, but i have some ideas, and would welcome any input

one character i've thought about is serpent society.  with the negate and tm avoid, they are usually targetted pretty fast, despite the grid.  i think an acrobatics card, or possibly the opd shift would be a great card for them

what does the community think of trying to put together an ultimate evil expansion?

the only problem with juggernaut is his lack of a proper avoid
he should have a negate (because of his unstoppability)
not to mention the personal force field
perhaps make his ignore blow a cw avoid(much like blobs absorb impact)
or perhaps an AH like visions double density

what does the community think of trying to put together an ultimate evil expansion?
or just expand on absolute evil expansion
http://justabgkid.com/emporium/absoluteevilmain.html

I'd be happy to assist with working on an Ultimate Evil expansion. I'll have to look around to see if I have my notes from a few years ago. The group I played with came up with a number of specials for the villains of Marvel and DC, about one per character in most instances with some exceptions. We used some of the new Marvels specials and other existing specials and if I recall correctly, we modified a few specials for some of the characters (I remember putting together a couple unique specials for Loki).

I would suggest adding a few new villains to the roster, the same way Marvels added Angel and Wasp. There are quite a few classic villains that OverPower never got around to creating cards for, so I would suggest the following:

Annihilus (7-6-5-5)
Baron Zemo (2-6-3-7)
Kang (7-6-3-7)
Loki (7-3-3-7)
Thanos (8-4-7-6) Our small group gave Thanos an inherent, similar to the one Malebolgia has, where he could only use Energy power cards for attacks and he would count for 23 points for tournament deckbuilding.
Ultron (7-4-6-5)
Mephisto (7-2-2-7)
Fin Fang Foom (don't know enough about him to put together a grid, but he's a classic)
and let's not forget some of the classic Spider-Man villains that didn't get a character card like Kraven, Electro, Vulture and Chameleon.

Back in the day we used the Marvel trading cards that were produced by Impel in the early 90's to create custom characters and we used proxy cards to represent specials for all the characters I listed above with a grid. Jack helped me out sometime ago by printing high quality character cards of the first six guys I listed above with artwork I sent him, so we could use those as a base for the characters. I'll take a look to see if I can find the specials I used for the characters. I know Loki had a draw 3 and a negate, Thanos had a high level fighting attack and an avoid, Kang and Zemo are two of my favorite villains but I can't recall all the specials we used for them. Zemo had a teammate avoid and a card that allowed him to use Thunderbolts specials but I'm drawing a blank at the moment for the specials Kang had.

In any event, I think it would be a fun side project. Depending on interest, we could work on just coming up with ideal specials for the existing villains and from there progress to a few new characters. Something to consider for sure.

Quote from: TGW on August 27, 2012, 11:04:48 AM
There are quite a few classic villains that OverPower never got around to creating cards for, so I would suggest the following:

Annihilus (7-6-5-5)
Baron Zemo (2-6-3-7)
Kang (7-6-3-7)
Loki (7-3-3-7)
Thanos (8-4-7-6) Our small group gave Thanos an inherent, similar to the one Malebolgia has, where he could only use Energy power cards for attacks and he would count for 23 points for tournament deckbuilding.
Ultron (7-4-6-5)
Mephisto (7-2-2-7)
Fin Fang Foom (don't know enough about him to put together a grid, but he's a classic)
and let's not forget some of the classic Spider-Man villains that didn't get a character card like Kraven, Electro, Vulture and Chameleon.

Cool. All characters from that list were done by other homemakers, like me, CCTelander or the classic Eboladude. It would be great to see the work from another homemaker. Do you have scans from your cards?

Quote from: Bios on August 27, 2012, 12:37:11 PM

Quote from: TGW on August 27, 2012, 11:04:48 AM
There are quite a few classic villains that OverPower never got around to creating cards for, so I would suggest the following:

Annihilus (7-6-5-5)
Baron Zemo (2-6-3-7)
Kang (7-6-3-7)
Loki (7-3-3-7)
Thanos (8-4-7-6) Our small group gave Thanos an inherent, similar to the one Malebolgia has, where he could only use Energy power cards for attacks and he would count for 23 points for tournament deckbuilding.
Ultron (7-4-6-5)
Mephisto (7-2-2-7)
Fin Fang Foom (don't know enough about him to put together a grid, but he's a classic)
and let's not forget some of the classic Spider-Man villains that didn't get a character card like Kraven, Electro, Vulture and Chameleon.

Cool. All characters from that list were done by other homemakers, like me, CCTelander or the classic Eboladude. It would be great to see the work from another homemaker. Do you have scans from your cards?

When I used to play with my group, we used the Marvel cards from the early 90's produced by Impel as the character cards and devised our own grids and used proxy cards for the specials that we came up with to play. It was fun but it wasn't the same as having actual custom character cards. The lack of true customs was due to not having anyone in the group that was good with photoshop or other editing tools, but we made do with what we had.

Well, fast forward several years later and I came across Jack's youtube videos and saw his custom Galactus. I reached out to him to ask if he could create custom cards for me using artwork I had gathered online and grids I created years ago. I also asked for a printout of his four grid Galactus and a Beyonder reprint as I sold mine a few years back. We worked out a price for the work and materials and 40 custom cards were created and I do have to say that they are very good, in both quality of image and overall printout. It's so cool to actually use a Baron Zemo character card with Red Skull against Cap and Falcon.

The link to the custom cards is listed below. I came up with the grid stats and submitted a number of images from my archive to Jack, who picked the ones that worked out best for the printout. Major props again to Jack, I can't thank him enough for bringing to life some of my favorite characters that never saw character cards in OP such as Kang, Zemo, Thanos, Dr. Hurt, Swamp Thing, Constantine and revised grids for Superman and Batman. I created the new DC JLA (minus Flash who's original OP card is just fine the way it is) with updated grids and images. I switched up Wonder Woman to have an 8 strength and 7 fighting to have as an alternate to her original OP card, which I think is perfect to begin with, I just wanted a different grid and her new costume to switch things up.

Here is the link, comments are appreciated:

Edit: correct address is: http://jackt.org/john

Quote from: TGW on August 27, 2012, 01:27:19 PM
http://jack.org/john

the link is not working... you sure this is the right address?

Quote from: Bios on August 27, 2012, 01:33:49 PM

Quote from: TGW on August 27, 2012, 01:27:19 PM
http://jack.org/john

the link is not working... you sure this is the right address?

Try this:

http://jackt.org/john

quick edit: The Wasp card is not my image or grid. I found that one online and requested a printout. Not sure who created that one, maybe yourself or someone you know Bios?

Those are great homemades! I specially liked the Anti-Monitor. Lots of characters from DC, by the way.

I don't know who created that Wasp. I would say it was Jack's work.

Most people at my playing group are DC fans, while I am a "pure" Marvel reader. Since I have the last word in the editorial decision, I am current making my fourth Marvel homemade set, against two finished DC sets. 
But my friends are telling me that my next set has to be DC. What can I say? So be it!

Here is my link if you are interested, but you already made some of them:
http://www.mediafire.com/?ela1jn2tny114ib

Quote from: Bios on August 27, 2012, 02:13:54 PM
Those are great homemades! I specially liked the Anti-Monitor. Lots of characters from DC, by the way.

I don't know who created that Wasp. I would say it was Jack's work.

Most people at my playing group are DC fans, while I am a "pure" Marvel reader. Since I have the last word in the editorial decision, I am current making my fourth Marvel homemade set, against two finished DC sets. 
But my friends are telling me that my next set has to be DC. What can I say? So be it!

Here is my link if you are interested, but you already made some of them:
http://www.mediafire.com/?ela1jn2tny114ib

I'm looking forward to checking out the link. I'm at work now, so mediafire is blocked (I have three screens in my office, two for work and one for sites like this and some other non-work sites). I'm a big fan of custom cards. I love Marvel and DC just about equally, but Batman is my very favorite. Grant Morrison is one of my favorite writers so I wanted to capture some of his takes on Batman characters such as Damian Wayne, the Joker and the Batman Inc. version of Bats.

I really wish I was better with photoshop, and I'd need to pick up a better printer, because I would print up all the custom character cards I could find. I'd love to get my hands on customs for the rest of Spider-Man's rogue gallery, for example, or characters featured in Grant Morrison's run of X-Men and I really want to put customs together for X23 and Hope Summers. I'm looking forward to checking out the mediafire link later this evening.