Palatinus' OverPower Forum

Hi all thought I would stop in and say hi. My brother Michael and I were the original developers that designed and sold this game to Fleer. Glad to see its still around and still getting played!!

Theo Stern

Welcome! and thanks for the game!

I posted a little bit of what I have put together as the history of Overpower on this thread
http://www.beenhereandthere.com/SMF/index.php?topic=159.0

If you have any additions or corrections please add them. There are a few people here who would love to hear about the early history of the game and how it moved from PowerPlayers to OverPower.

As a more general question did Fleer approach you for this game (ie solicit a game design) or was it something you pitched to them? What input, if any, did you have after you'd produced PowerPlayers?

Thanks,
John

Welcome! 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vh78T--ZUxY&feature=related

I take back everything negative I've said about the game!   

Except about the level 4 AR specials! *joking*

Glad to see some of the original design team present! Welcome aboard, many if us were looking fir some designer insights on making 1) basic/training universe and 2) doubleshots playable.

Additionally, would you happen to know if Gabriel "Gabe" Alonso helped with either playtestibg or design?

Sorry for the bombardment of questions, but:

Did you make a conscious effort to design a game that didn't have a resource system or costs for cards? After the explosion of CCGs that happened around 1995, most of the games out were either bad Magic clones or overly complex with various resource mechanics. Overpower not having a cost to play cards (besides some simple requirements) makes it really easy to teach someone how to play in just a few minutes, so I was just curious if that was something that you intentionally set out to do.

As a sort of followup to John's question, if you weren't approached to create a game specifically for the Marvel license, did you have any other IP in mind when you designed the game system? It would be kind of funny to find out that characters were originally wizards or space marines or something, using swords and such as basic universe cards.

Did you arrive at the number 8 (or 9 in earlier builds?) as the highest level stat through playtesting, or was it just an arbitrary cutoff?

It sounds like you didn't design any cards in later sets, but did you keep up with the latest releases to see what the developers were doing with your game engine? Did you play the game at all after its initial release? If so, what were your feelings at the time (or now) about the card effects that were being designed for your system?

In that linked thread there is a little conjecture about the implementation of venturing, so it would be cool to hear anything you might know about that too.

Overpower surely meant a great deal to some of us, so thanks for checking in.

Welcome to the forums, Theo! Truly an honor to have you here with us. 

Lets see what I can do to answer these-

Sorry for the bombardment of questions, but:

Did you make a conscious effort to design a game that didn't have a resource system or costs for cards? After the explosion of CCGs that happened around 1995, most of the games out were either bad Magic clones or overly complex with various resource mechanics. Overpower not having a cost to play cards (besides some simple requirements) makes it really easy to teach someone how to play in just a few minutes, so I was just curious if that was something that you intentionally set out to do.

We wanted something that allowed for combos like Magic, but we did not think the resource cost fit the genre

As a sort of followup to John's question, if you weren't approached to create a game specifically for the Marvel license, did you have any other IP in mind when you designed the game system? It would be kind of funny to find out that characters were originally wizards or space marines or something, using swords and such as basic universe cards.

We were approached to do the specific license. My younger brother Michael was a game designer for West End Games which was how we got tapped to free lance on this project

Did you arrive at the number 8 (or 9 in earlier builds?) as the highest level stat through playtesting, or was it just an arbitrary cutoff?

I honestly can't remember, it was a lot of years ago

It sounds like you didn't design any cards in later sets, but did you keep up with the latest releases to see what the developers were doing with your game engine? Did you play the game at all after its initial release? If so, what were your feelings at the time (or now) about the card effects that were being designed for your system?

To be honest, we were not entirely happy with the removal of some of the mechanics we felt were iconic to the genre like flying, ranged attacks and the ability to climb or fly up on buildings. The game as it turned out is quite a bit of fun, but I personally think it could have been much better were we allowed to pursue those mechanics. Having said that, we were well paid and I am glad the game was purchased and people enjoyed and are enjoying it. After the initial release I did some convention work for Fleer, but I did no work on the expansions. They hired some collage kids to do those at a much reduced rate. I remember at Gencon Steve asked me to play some Guru kid they hired who was supposed to be their new Overpower expert. I giot great satisfaction in beating him soundly I honestly have not kept up with all the new mechanics they added

In that linked thread there is a little conjecture about the implementation of venturing, so it would be cool to hear anything you might know about that too.

Venturing was something that another game design company that was also trying to win the deal came up with. Bill Jemas, the president of Fleer, liked poker and was really set on it, but liked the rest of our game better, as a result it was incorporated into our game.

Overpower surely meant a great deal to some of us, so thanks for checking in.

Glad you have gotten so much enjoyment from it

Quote from: Theo on May 16, 2011, 07:40:42 AM
Venturing was something that another game design company that was also trying to win the deal came up with. Bill Jemas, the president of Fleer, liked poker and was really set on it, but liked the rest of our game better, as a result it was incorporated into our game.

Serendipity. 

I've always wondered what original designers thought about the demise of universe cards: basic/training. Did you later ever consider ways to make them playable?

Quote from: Nostalgic on May 16, 2011, 12:02:56 PM
Serendipity. 

I've always wondered what original designers thought about the demise of universe cards: basic/training. Did you later ever consider ways to make them playable?

Seeing as how he didn't keep up on new mechanics, he might not know how the metagame has evolved.

So, Theo, what are you up to nowadays? Game development, or something else? Ever see yourself getting pack into playing OP? Ever see yourself using your leverage to coax some companies into picking OP back up?

Quote
To be honest, we were not entirely happy with the removal of some of the mechanics we felt were iconic to the genre like flying, ranged attacks and the ability to climb or fly up on buildings. The game as it turned out is quite a bit of fun, but I personally think it could have been much better were we allowed to pursue those mechanics. Having said that, we were well paid and I am glad the game was purchased and people enjoyed and are enjoying it. After the initial release I did some convention work for Fleer, but I did no work on the expansions. They hired some collage kids to do those at a much reduced rate. I remember at Gencon Steve asked me to play some Guru kid they hired who was supposed to be their new Overpower expert. I giot great satisfaction in beating him soundly I honestly have not kept up with all the new mechanics they added

Venturing was something that another game design company that was also trying to win the deal came up with. Bill Jemas, the president of Fleer, liked poker and was really set on it, but liked the rest of our game better, as a result it was incorporated into our game.

man I wish they would have let you guys play with those mechanic's a bit I think it would of brought so much more to the game.

When I was playing this growing up I never messed with venturing  it was dumb to me.

Honestly, we could have made anything playable. In our early versions each player would play out environment cards that both players could use, buildings and such had a height rating and if you had climb or fly you could go up on the building, once up there you could only be attacked by someone else that could get up there, or by a ranged attack. Bill thought the idea of having to teach someone to play with range and height was too hard *shrugs* We also wanted things you could pick up and throw or hit someone with like cars lamp posts or manhole covers. The idea was you would set the stage of the environment first and then battle. They wanted to keep the environment cards like manhole cover but made it a card played from your hand instead.

As for what I am doing, I am out of the gaming industry and work for a call center software company. I still game quite a bit, but game design is not an industry that pays all that well, so my gaming is likely to stay a fun pass-time now

Did either your brother or yourself require any kind of courses from the university level to become game designers?  I've looked into that sort of thing myself, more out of my personal intrests in all things gaming, but have found that almost all the courses are gear exclusively to video gaming.  Do you need a degree in programming to design a board or card game?

No degree is required, my brother has a Bachelors degree from Bard in film making and I have only an Associates in Electronics engineering. Degrees that are useful for game design would be Math for designing games systems (There is a lot of probability theory) and English/literature for most RP style games. The game industry is a tough fairly low paying industry, which is why I am not really in it any more. We both had regular jobs while we worked on Overpower in the evenings. getting what we got was a huge boost of cash for both of us at that point in our lives, but if that was all we made over the 9 months we worked on Overpower, it would not have been great. My regular job, even back then payed far more. The likely hood of me making in the game industry what I make now, would be extremely low. The only way to make a lot of money in the industry is to develop a hit like Magic in the collectable card space, or Catan in the board game space and keep the rights to it. Don't get me wrong, if you love doing it you can make a modest living at it especially if you live somewhere the cost of living is low, but your measure of success will be a function of your creativity, drive, and a bit of luck.

Hope that helps

Thank you very much!  I've been toying with trying to create a new game engine for a card game, but as of yet, I haven't been able to solidify anything.  I appreciate the info, and I'll review my probability chapters for formulas I may be forgetting or never really learned.

The Stern brother's game was a wonderful gamer game, but it wasn't a mass-market game. Fleer didn't want a Marvel licensed CCG that only appealed to players already in the market. The game had to have a mechanic that would appeal to those familiar with WOTC and Decipher fans, but it had to be easy enough that a 7 year old who loved X-men or Spider-man could pick it up and start playing after a brief lesson.  The first Comic-con where we introduced the game, we were teaching kids and adults in 30 minute sessions and then we had mini-tournaments.  At the time, there weren't many CCGs where you could get someone ready to play in a tournament in as little as 30 minutes.  All the cool things that the Stern brother's game had (flight, ranged combat, environments) would have taken too long to teach and would have required way too many different types of cards to include in an intro deck.  In its hayday, I saw so many youngsters playing and enjoying the game.  I did not see those ages playing Magic or STTNG, or even StarWars.  Pokemon would be the only other game that achieved a younger fan base (and boy was that popular).