Variant Characters and Grids

[Palatinus]

I actually used my first homebase today.

Latveria
Invisible Woman: Malice
Human Torch: Invaders
Silver Surfer
3-Stat Dr. Doom (R)

I still lost, but it was fun.

That sounds like a pretty fun team.  I like both the variant cards.  I wish Thing and Mr. Fantastic had variants.

[Nostalgic]

That sounds like a pretty fun team.  I like both the variant cards.  I wish Thing and Mr. Fantastic had variants.

I think if OP kept going just about every character probably would have got a variant card. I mean the different stats would have greatly expanded possible team builds and special card combos. 

[Palatinus]

That sounds like a pretty fun team.  I like both the variant cards.  I wish Thing and Mr. Fantastic had variants.

I think if OP kept going just about every character probably would have got a variant card. I mean the different stats would have greatly expanded possible team builds and special card combos. 

That seems very likely, especially given that in VS they gave lots of characters lots of versions.

[Nostalgic]

In some ways, it seems they tried to cover variants with some chracters  special cards. For instance instead of a variant like beast: the brute for wolverine they gave him a EQ special. (Though wolverine alread had a couple of variants... ) Based on the 'variant theory' it would probably be an interesting study if hypothetically grids were elimenated and just special cards where considered in character combos.

[gameplan.exe]

That sounds like a pretty fun team.  I like both the variant cards.  I wish Thing and Mr. Fantastic had variants.

I think if OP kept going just about every character probably would have got a variant card. I mean the different stats would have greatly expanded possible team builds and special card combos. 

My brothers and I are always talking about variant grids. One of my favorite grids to consider is
Gambit: New Son. Recently, I've settled into 8-4-3-5

[BigBadHarve]

My brothers and I are always talking about variant grids. One of my favorite grids to consider is
Gambit: New Son. Recently, I've settled into 8-4-3-5

I always thought Gambit should have a better grid, but do you think he really warrants an 8 energy?

-BBH

[Palatinus]

My brothers and I are always talking about variant grids. One of my favorite grids to consider is
Gambit: New Son. Recently, I've settled into 8-4-3-5

I always thought Gambit should have a better grid, but do you think he really warrants an 8 energy?

-BBH

There have definitely been times where Gambit's power level was off the charts.

[gameplan.exe]

My brothers and I are always talking about variant grids. One of my favorite grids to consider is
Gambit: New Son. Recently, I've settled into 8-4-3-5

I always thought Gambit should have a better grid, but do you think he really warrants an 8 energy?

-BBH

Did you read his ongoing series (it went 25 issues)? If not, I recommend it, that's where Gambit: New Son appears and it reveals a lot about Gambit's actual potential. I'm a fanboy, so it's hard to be unbiased, but I always thought it was well written.

Anyway, it's a great example of what a Variant Character card is all about...

As long as we're talking about Gambit Variants... Gambit: Horseman Of Apocalypse 7-7-4-2

[Palatinus]

A 7 or 8 energy would certainly make a Danger Room team more powerful.  In that regard, an energy based Beast would really improve some of the team possibilities with Beast's locations.  Beast is such a great character, but he is mostly stuck on homebases full of energy characters.

[BigBadHarve]

Did you read his ongoing series (it went 25 issues)? If not, I recommend it, that's where Gambit: New Son appears and it reveals a lot about Gambit's actual potential. I'm a fanboy, so it's hard to be unbiased, but I always thought it was well written.

Anyway, it's a great example of what a Variant Character card is all about...

As long as we're talking about Gambit Variants... Gambit: Horseman Of Apocalypse 7-7-4-2

No, not something I'm familiar with. If it's suitable, then it's all good. I just didn't see Gambit with an 8 energy. (Especially since someone like Silver Surfer only has a 7(?!??!))

I think from a game perspective, alternates/clones should be balanced in some way to so that their original counterparts aren't redundant. They've dropped the ball on some of them, but others work.

Invisible Woman: Malice has a nice grid, but regular invisible woman has a good inherent. Both are viable options.

Jean Grey: Dark Phoenix also has the wicked grid, but Jean Grey IQ is a nice, inexpensive 16 points.

Conversely - I think they dropped the ball on Hulk: Mr. Fixit, being 2 points higher than his regular counter part, and two of his suits are already covered. The only reason for using Mr. Fixit over Regular Hulk is on a fighting team. But I do like Fixit's inherent, it has come in handy.

-BBH

[Palatinus]

I agree with BBH about making variants worthwhile.  I think Angel was poorly done in this regard.  You have a 7F with either a 6E or a 6S which seems like a good idea . . . but really you just get a fighting character that either adds one S teamwork or one E teamwork.  That's not real variety.  And of course if you consider his Marvels, you get a 7F with . . . a slightly lower cost and no extra teamworks.

[gameplan.exe]

I agree with BBH about making variants worthwhile.  I think Angel was poorly done in this regard.  You have a 7F with either a 6E or a 6S which seems like a good idea . . . but really you just get a fighting character that either adds one S teamwork or one E teamwork.  That's not real variety.  And of course if you consider his Marvels, you get a 7F with . . . a slightly lower cost and no extra teamworks.

Truly, I like the variants as much for their themes as their grids, though. Otherwise, why would you ever use regular Beast? Beast: The Brute is still a 6-7 but in more accessable power types (i.e., not INT), and he's only a 17 (instead of a 20).

[Palatinus]

Well, one reason to use regular beast is the excellent art on the card!  But I agree, themes can be really fun, but they are most fun when they use game-play effects to really bring them out.  Like Angel, the themes of his cards are interesting, but give him a cool, thematic inherent and then I'm really on board.  Wolverine is probably the best example of meaningless variants now that I think about it.  All 3 are 19, there is very little difference in stats, except Golden Age goes from an 8 to a 7.  They could really have had fun with those characters if they had tried.  I really think that inherent abilities were very under-used.  I would even like to have seen more useless IA's just for the themes.

[Demacus]

Isn't the only difference between I.Q. Wolvie and AoA:Wolvie, aside from the artwork, just a swapped strength and Intellect rating?  2-8-4-5/2-8-5-4?

Speaking of variants, and I mentioned this in the other thread about grid power level breakdowns, I've always been a fan of level 0 and superhigh (mobius) like Beyonder stats.  Where almost no character would rate a lvl 0 intellect, there are those who's energy abilitys truely warrant a 0 pt stat, lack of fighting prowess or even being incredibly weak could also justify a lvl 0 on the grid, but of course if you are so detrimental in a stat as to warrant a 0, your other three stats should be pretty viable.  6-6-0-6 makes for a pretty well rounded 18 point charcter, you could even drop a 7 or 2 in that line-up and become a true teamwork machine at just 19 or 20 points.

On the flip-side, there are characters who've proven to be above and beyond even their peers.  Hulk, for example, has a STR of 8, as does Thing, as does Namor, as does Darkseid, but Hulk, unlike the rest, doesn't have a cap on his STR capabilities.  He has actually kept an entire mountain from crushing himself and other heroes, simply because one of the others had the gumption to piss him off to the point that he had the strength to keep a mountain off of them.  Dr. Doom, through his incredible planning and scheming has actually conquered the world on at least 1 occasion, only to give-up his power gladly when finally challenged by heroes who, through random happenstance were unaffected by his control, simply because he was bored ruling a world without conflict.  To these characters, and others like them, I would suggest repeating the Mobius stat seen on Beyonder's character card, but only in the 1 stat that these characters warrant that extra boost over their "peers."  The stat would not function differently from the 8 stat in terms of playing power cards for attack and defense, but would make the characters slightly more expensive then if they simply had an 8, and would generate a preventative defense for themselves or their team.  Cards with {x} icon may not be used to attack or defend against attacks from a character with a {mobius} stat, where {x} is the stat the {mobius} is in.  In Hulk's case, you can't possibly be stronger then he is...  And how can you outthink a man who's thought of everything before you even met?  As far as the cost, make the Mobius count as 9 or 10 points in that stat when adding the character's stats for deckbuilding...  OR any character with a Mobius counts as 23 points for deckbuilding, no matter what their other stats are.

Ideas I've personally toyed with over the years since Beyonder became a real thing. 

[steve2275]

A 7 or 8 energy would certainly make a Danger Room team more powerful.  In that regard, an energy based Beast would really improve some of the team possibilities with Beast's locations.  Beast is such a great character, but he is mostly stuck on homebases full of energy characters.

just give him the serpent crown 

i also think  regular shadowcat should have a 6 or 7 fighting